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wpe6DD.jpg (5528 bytes) Issue: January 11th, 2009
 Story 092805
ABSTRACTED MINUTES - ASSOCIATION MEETING, October 2008...

Attendees ... Delegates from:- Apologies from:-
The Executive ...
  • President
  • Vice President
  • Secretary

Visitors ...

  • Mr Blundell
  • Mr Tossell
  • Mr Grogan
  • Winston Hills
  • Castle Hill
  • Baulkham Hills
  • Kings Langley
  • Kellyville
  • Schofields
  • Hawkesbury
  • Oakville
  • Carlingford
  • Rouse Hill

  • Correspondence inwards and outwards was tabled.
  • Minutes from the previous meeting were taken as read.

Secretary's Report
Mr Yard provided this written report ...

Make no mistake Baseball is in a serious downturn. Hills can only get three first Division Under 8 teams (we coerced a fourth team), five Division one Under 12 and at least one of them should not be there, four in Hay and certainly one should not be there. I think everyone is struggling for players. The playing level is the lowest ever in Hills and there is very little teaching going on anywhere that I can see. Numbers are certainly falling. Hills have/ had 96 teams (I think only our first two years of operation were lower)... Greater West has 68 teams despite a very active recruitment drive.

Baseball will be removed from NSWIS Program as from 30 September. I also understand that Softball is gone also and maybe some other team sports. The other State Institutes have held off removing Baseball until about May next year i.e. to the end of the financial year. NSWIS may have jumped due to funding problems. How keen the Clubs NSW are about putting more money into the NSWIS as a result of Government policies will be interesting. The new Federal Sports Minister wants a full review of all sports funding and has made statements about duplicate funding between state institutes and the AIS and the fact that the states appear to be head-hunting top athletes just to get a name for their program. Coates (AOC) wants more money so shall be interesting battle of the minds. On this basis it may be that funding is being delayed to see what the review comes up with. Certainly there will be no AOC money for Baseball or Softball for the next four years. Both baseball and softball have been lobbying hard to get back into the Olympics in 2016 and the next vote is due about July 2009.

With all this the ABF wants to fight with the diminishing number of volunteers the sport has. It and the State Bodies have a mode of operation that is Divide and Conquer. Hills’ competitions would be much better if clubs did not have two eyes on a Premiership but rather challenged the players to play as higher grade as possible.

 Victorian Clubs continue to fight on Tuesday night for the ‘rubber ball program’ to co-exist with LL. The VBA wishes to abolish the ‘rubber ball’ program. Over the years we have been down the path before with Community Based competitions - same idea as LL. They never worked either. LL’s advantage is the trips for winners and the fact that States do not enjoy the Independence they once had. LL is here whether it stays is up to ABF - so far they, through the State Bodies, have made LL two emotive and very dirty words. At least Bruce Auty recognized that fact when in his report to the Annual General Meeting stated “the concept of Little League continues to be much broader than a change in a few field dimensions.”

Little League does not work on top of Club Based structure – it is a three month School Holiday Program in America. The player pool here is not as big – but for it to work you need to be able to conduct a ‘draft’ system to equalize player strength. Hills were established in the hope that it could be a Pony League type Association. Club loyalty killed that idea some 22 years ago and the same club based traditions apply today.

For a long time now I have been telling you that the ultimate aim NSW Baseball was to remove at least the importance of Associations if not the Associations themselves. The first formal indication that came in the CEO’s Annual Report – which stated “Our volunteers do an excellent job but we are struggling to attract additional recruits, mainly because in today's society the clock is moving too fast and there are so many attractions to partake in. I continue to see those same old faces absorb an ever increasing burden of tasks. Strategically speaking, I would encourage future streamlining of many organisations so as to eliminate the duplicated volunteer resources that currently exist."

He continues:- "I realize the concept will receive a large amount of emotional resistance but I truly think it is a model worthy of public debate and earnest consideration, particularly to strengthen those links to pathways from grass roots through to senior recreational and Major League playing ranks.”

We will await further details of what is ‘planned’.

There is a problem in Leonard South as Schofields struggle to field teams in both Under 11 and Under 12. The problem is large enough for the Under 12 to be disbanded and dispensations sought for the 11 year olds to play Street South (not sure that they can cope) and the 10 year olds in the team going back into the Under 11 competition.

It was disappointing that Schofields did not withdraw its team last week rather than forfeiting. I had a temporary redraw to be issued before I went to Singapore that would have overcome the problem last week but received no reply to the question about withdrawing the team. With Schofields’ withdrawal there will be a change to the draw for next Saturday. Hopefully that will be issued tomorrow – the complete re draw will be issued later in the week or early next week.

There were a number of games transferred from the 4th October. Those games now become a twilight game and have to be played by 7 February. They are subject to the normal restrictions of 128 pitches in a five day period and the two days rest periods for pitchers throwing above a minor in mid week games.

Kellyville are far from pleased with the decision of Winston Hills and Quakers Hill not to play its Youth League game last Friday night. I was in Singapore but unless someone can come up with a very good reason why the game was not played then the game, as far as I am concerned will be declared a ‘no game’. Clubs cannot make their own arrangements otherwise we will finish with anachary. To ‘defer’ the game without advising Kellyville was very poor.

There are at least four dispensations for consideration tonight. Schofields has three and Castle Hill one. I refused to allow the Castle Hill dispensation (based on the voting trends at the last meeting) but the club chose to continue to play the player in Under 10. Winston Hills would like to vary the dispensation protocol for Madeline Charmichael (Under 14 to play Under 12) to allow her to catch in under 12.

I smile every time Baseball NSW accuses the Associations of poor communication. No doubt Hills and other Associations will be criticized for not attending the Baseball NSW Strategy Workshop late last month.

The truth is that it seems very few people knew about it. Certainly no correspondence was sent. If it was on their web site then Peter, Jeff and I all missed it. Some other Junior Associations report that they were contacted on the Friday and advised that the meeting was on the next day and could they send a representative. Neither Peter or I were contacted. They really are very poor communicators – no wonder the Workshop was poorly attended.

The State Under 14 team has been announced. There are six Hills players selected. Hayden Bray, Graham Clarke, Jordan Greenlees Brown, Zachary Shepherd, Tim Wakefield and Hayden Webster.

The Under 16 State Team is still to be finalized. It is a 24 player squad. Hills players named in that squad Josh Blanco, Ben Cone, Harrison Garrett, Josh Guyer, Ben Macerola, Dominic Woodward and Jacob Younis.

We have a problem in Hay League. As you know it is a four team competition but Hawkesbury are really struggling.

I don't really have a ready made answer for you.

While Hawkesbury cannot compete at the level of Hay League I am just as certain Winston Hills are not a Division One team either and the re-grading Winston Hills for Hawkesbury just transfers the problem - does not fix a thing.

The days of clubs like Baulkham Hills and Castle Hill splitting their strength and entering two even teams are well gone. To be honest Castle Hill just does not have the depth to do it this year- Baulkham Hills may have.

My only thought now is to combine Hay with Street South -but play two competitions in one as we cannot run a three team competition.

It involves dropping Hawkesbury Street North and probably Kings Langley to Street South (as they cannot compete in Street North, but then again I am not sure Carlingford can compete either).

This leaves three teams in Hay League – Baulkham Hills, Kellyville and Castle Hill. In Street North would be Hawkesbury, Winston Hills, Baulkham Hills and Carlingford.

The 'downer' is that Street North teams would have to pitch 54' - they already play off 80' base paths.

I would play one full round - seven weeks. Then two rounds where the first divisions play each other and the same with second division. That is a total of 13 weeks - may then goes back across the competitions to ensure they play enough games. What it does is share the pain a bit instead of being 'bashed up' every week

For the final series - Hay would be a three team comp.2v3 play week one winner to plays Minor Premier in grand final. Street North would have a traditional final series.

Do I think that the Clubs would like it- that answer is NO. I do not like it as it reduces the intensity for the players who are of true Hay League standard; however a solution has to be found.

An aside of Kings Langley being regarded is that I do not like the idea of the KL player who got dispensation from Under 17 playing third division - but I think it is their grade- even allowing for the fact that they have a State Cup player (Agnew) in their team.

The 'sweetener' to Winston Hills and Carlingford would be that we would not restrict Jordon Greenlees Brown or Victor Woo. They would be available to throw 54 pitches at least when playing the Hay League teams.

An option is to suggest they put the players in a draft - select one Hills Kings team to play first division. Remainder to Division 3 as Hills Kings teams based at say Sutton and Baulkham Hills.... that will not get one vote at a meeting – nor would the players like losing their identity with a particular club.

The benefit night for Dennis Castle is to be held on 8th November. Hills has a table booked. Jeff Catt is looking after the ‘numbers’ for the table.

There is an obvious problem with coaches either not knowing or ignoring the rules. Hills has issued a breach notice to Baulkham Hills in Under 12 Leonard South as a result of a player over pitching in a game against Castle Hill. The game was won by Baulkham Hills. Baulkham Hills agree that the coach did over pitch the player. 79 pitches compared to the allowable 65.

Personally I believe that the issue is a breach of what is a protection rule and the penalty should be the loss of the game. Coaches clearly have the responsibility to play within the rules. There are no reasons that abdicate that responsibility.

What does concern me is why this was not raise game day at the time of the breach. Really I do not want to be placed in the role of being a ‘policeman’.

Baulkham Hills on checking its teams details ‘discovered’ that Oakville Under 12 Leonard South team also over pitched – something like 89 pitches. You can rest assured that this is only the ‘tip of the iceberg’ – the ones that we are now aware of. It is time that we as an Association require that Result Sheets be submitted promptly – once a fortnight.

As a principle Hills would be extremely critical of any coach / team that allowed over pitching to occur and then protest. That would be seen as a contrived situation and as result would be extremely unlikely to be successful – the team breaching the rule may well lose the game but the opposition may not be awarded the win.

Team registration sheets are required to be forwarded to me ASAP. They are overdue. Once these are received Invoices will be issued for Player Registration. Is there a problem?

The Secretary’s report was accepted.

In addition to the written report Mr. Yard added that the Association should exercise control of what is being written, basically on its behalf.  He stated there has been correspondence which has reflected poorly on Hills.

Mr. Yard also foreshadowed that there will be a recommendation to alter the rule re pass balls in Under 10 competition.


NSWJBL Report ...

There was no meeting in September.


BNSW Junior League Standing Committee (JLSC) Report ...
Mr. Catt reported on the JLSC September meeting.
  • The meeting made decisions on the run relating to the revised rules in Under 12.  The entire meeting was devoted to playing rules.

  • Mr. Catt advised that the October meeting will be his last as delegate.  There has been no agenda received for the October meeting which is tomorrow night.

  • Mr. Schmidt advised that he had spoken to Mr. Willott on behalf of Hills applying for a charter to conduct Little League in Winter. There was no response to date.


Treasurer's Report ...
  • Statement of Financial Position was presented.
  • Payments were approved.
  • Debtors and liabilities were disclosed.


General Business ...
Dispensations – Individual player details not published here, by virtue of our Privacy Policy. Check with your club if needed.

Penalty Rate for Late Payment - It was agreed that the rate for late payment (after 30 days) will be 2% per week.

Over Pitching - There were two proven and admitted instances of over pitching in Leonard South. Baulkham Hills overpitched in a game against Castle Hill. Oakville overpitched in a game against Baulkham Hills. Baulkham Hills won both games. Mr. Yard stated that it was the responsibility of the teams’ Head Coach to ensure that the pitching rules be complied with. In discussing what penalties if any should be imposed, Mr. Yard stressed that the two cases had to be considered, not just the Baulkham Hills v Castle Hill game. It was resolved that Baulkham Hills would ‘lose’ the game against Castle Hill. The difference in the score was small enough for the overpitching to make a difference to the result. The game was awarded to Castle Hill and in accordance with the rules; the score of the game was Castle Hill 16 Baulkham Hills 10. The Board considered whether there should be any penalty against (a) The coaches involved ….and/or (b) Any penalty against the clubs.

The meeting resolved that there be no action taken against the individual coaches or clubs. Mr Yard advised that the score in any game where overpitching occurs will be a significant factor in whether the game will be awarded to the non offending team.

Representative to JLSC – Mr. Schmidt advised that Mr. Catt is resigning as a member of Baseball NSW – JLSC. He stated that Mr. Catt has served Hills in an excellent manner and at a personal cost to himself. Neither Mr. Schmidt nor Mr. Yard are prepared to attend the JLSC. Clubs were asked whether there would be anyone from their clubs that maybe interested in representing Hills on the sub committee.

Mini Ball – Mr. Petrone advised that Mini Ball commences on Friday 17th October, 2008.

Regrading - Mr. Petrone advised that the coach of the Kellyville Cashmore League team would like to move the team to the Youth League competition. Mr. Yard advised that he doubted that the Kellyville team had sufficient pitching depth to compete at the Youth League level. He added that there is a possibility that the Cashmore League competition could be ‘split’ into two Conferences.

Base Plugs - Mr. Frew asked whether Hills could buy, on its behalf ten plugs for the anchors of breakaway bases. Mr. Yard replied that he would buy them. Hawkesbury ordered four.

Level 0 Coaching - Mr. Catt advised that a Level 0 Coaches Course would be held at Ashley Brown on Sunday 2nd November, 2008.

T Ball - Mr. Brown advised that the 25 ft. foul ball line was not being marked on diamonds. Nor was the rule of balls being required to cross this line, for it to be considered ‘in play’.

Bats in Youth League - Mr. Niemi queried what bats are legal in Under 17. Mr. Schmidt advised that Rule 6.7 states that the Hills provide for any bat permitted by BNSW for its Under 16 competition can be used in the Hills Youth and Cashmore Leagues.


NEXT MEETING is November 11th in the boardroom of REMA Industries at 7.30pm